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Transcript:

Caroline: We are recording today on the traditional, ancestral, and unceded territories of the Coast Salish and Kwakwaka’wakw peoples, including Tsleil-Waututh, Squamish, Musqueam, and K’ómoks first nations.

Caroline: Hello and welcome to Love To Sew. I’m Caroline, the owner of Blackbird Fabrics and BF Patterns.

Helen: And I’m Helen, the designer behind Helen’s Closet Patterns in Cedar Quilt Co.

Caroline: We’re two sewing buds who love to sew, and it’s basically all we wanna talk about.

Helen: Today we are interviewing Christine Millar, AKA Sewstine! She talks to us about her stunning historical costumes and where she wears them. We also cover how she creates these incredible gowns, from drafting the pattern to designing and machine embroidering the fabric.

Caroline: If you love to sew, this is your show. Hi, Helen.

Helen: Hi, Caroline.

Caroline: Today’s guest is bringing something a little different to the podcast. Christine Millar, known online as Sewstine, is known for her absolutely stunning 18th century gowns. She’s also an accomplished machine embroiderer. She even designs her own historically-inspired embroidery files. And in addition to all that, she has a day job as an anesthesiologist, a great YouTube channel, and a wardrobe of romantic me-mades for everyday wear. I have so many questions for her. I think we should get into it.

Helen: Yes. Hello, Christine! Thank you so much for coming on the show today.

Christine: Hi, Helen. Hi, Caroline. Thank you so much for inviting me.

Helen: We can’t wait to chat with you all about historical costuming today, but we’re gonna start by asking the question that we ask all of our guests, which is: how and when did you learn how to sew?

Christine: So, my mother taught me when I was five. I still remember, the very first thing that I made was a little pin cushion for her, and we still have it, actually. But, the thing is, my parents didn’t let me sew all that much, because in Korea, sewing was considered not a good wage-maker. So my mom really tried to discourage me from sewing. Clearly it didn’t work.

Helen: She got you hooked, and then she was like, “No, don’t do it.” And you were like, “I can’t! I can’t stop!”

Christine: Exactly. I still remember, when I was 14, we grew up really poor, so my mom couldn’t buy me a fancy dress, so she sewed me one, and I turned out to be the best-dressed one at the party. And that feeling of walking in wearing a dress that you know fits you to perfection, even at 13, was so mind-altering that I became hooked on making dresses forever.

Helen: Oh, I love that. Okay. I wanna hear a bit more about your journey as a historical costumer. When did your interest in historical costuming start?

Christine: So, I always loved costuming. In general, I think that costumes are the most fun way to sew things, because you don’t necessarily wanna sew things you can just buy off the rack. So I’ve always been part of the cosplay scene in the, in New York City, back in, like, the early 2000s, there were, there was Comic-Con, and costuming and cosplay weren’t that big then. But I really enjoyed cosplay. I kind of realized that my favourite dresses in movies were all historical ones. For instance, Sleepy Hollow. You know the black and white dress that she wears for, like, 10 seconds at the end of that movie?

Helen: I know it now, from following you and seeing your version of it, and it’s my favourite one that you’ve made. I love black and white print, so it’s just everything.

Christine: Thank you so much. That dress lived rent-free in my head for probably two decades, and I’ve made it four times now. And, really, that dress is what got me into historical costuming because I made it, but realized in order to make it look good, I needed a corset and I needed panniers and I needed all this. So I just kept making it over and over again.

Helen: Wow, that’s amazing. I can’t believe you’ve made it four times. Wow.

Christine: Each time it’s different. My last one, I think I finally got it right. It turns out that the secret is: not only do you have to have the right undergarments and the right shapewear and know how to make 18th century costumes, but it’s also that you have to get a sharpie and draw the stripes in yourself.

Helen: Wait, what? You drew them in onto, like, an ivory silk?

Christine: Yes. So, someone sent me a museum, the dress in a museum exhibit, and it said that the stripes were actually just drawn in with sharpie. And once I realized that, I realized why the stripes were one inch and one inch and a quarter apart as opposed to one inch, one inch, one inch, one inch. But that slight difference made such a huge difference to me.

Helen: Oh my gosh. That must have been very time-consuming. And also it’s incredibly brave to take sharpie to fabric. Like, were you so nervous about that?

Christine: I wasn’t that nervous because, I figured, if I made a mistake, what’s another, paying for another yard to make the dress of your dreams, right?

Caroline: Mm.

Helen: Preach. I love it.

Christine: But the biggest problem was that, after, like, an hour of sharpie-ing, you get a really bad headache.

Caroline: Oh no, the fumes!

Christine: The fumes are real. So I actually had to switch to Arteza markers. And Arteza makes these great fabric markers. They don’t bleed that much. I actually experimented with about six different brands of markers to find the perfect one and the silk taffeta that bled the least. So, between the two of them, and I wanna say about a hundred hours of just drawing stripes in, I’ve managed to make the dress.

Caroline: Oh my gosh. This is an incredible story. Was this the first costume that you made, or was this, like, further down in your journey?

Christine: I would say that I’d made other historical gowns. I love steampunk, and I was really big into steampunk back when it was big in New York in 2008. Oh my God, that just dates myself. But, because steampunk was so big then, I would make these, uh, 1880s bustle dresses go to steampunk festivals. But, really, the, I would say that my, like, gateway dress into historical costuming was definitely the Sleepy Hollow dress because you, really, the only way to make it look right is to have the right 18th century stays, know about 18th century dress construction, and then also, sharpie the fabric.

Helen: The secret was sharpie-ing the fabric all along.

Christine: Yes.

Helen: Well, we are gonna get into some of these technical details with Christine, so don’t worry, listeners, but I would love to hear about taking us from that Sleepy Hollow dress, the first one, ‘til now. How has your historical costuming journey progressed over the years?

Christine: I have to say, compared to a lot of other costumers, I was a very slow grower. I knew the basics of pattern construction and machine sewing all through undergrad and I would just sew my costumes for conventions. However, once I got into medical school, I had less time for sewing. So I would really pick one or two dresses a year to make. I’m a very slow seamstress. I don’t claim to make a lot of dresses. I just take my time and go very slowly with them. And in medical school I got more and more into the Victorian historical costuming sewing groups. I honestly read a lot of blogs. I don’t know if you remember the time when American Duchess had a blog about historical sewing and she had a lot of tips. And I just remember reading voraciously on the internet about how to sew. And once I got out of medical school into residency, I continued, and I realized, at that point, that’s when I really focused in on historical costuming. I managed to buy some proper underwear now that I was no longer, you know, a poor medical student. I was making very minimal as a resident, but that was still making something as opposed to just paying for medical school. So at that point I was able to invest in an actual 1880s corset, some, a proper bustle instead of a pillow tied to a string. And I got much more into it. And at that point, I think that’s where I started progressing a little bit more and more. And I definitely would say that my two favourite eras were 1770s to 1780s to about 1880s to about 1890s. And I think it’s about how you have that beautiful hourglass shape and you have dresses with such incredible silhouettes. So around that time is when I started getting more and more technical and learned how to pleat better, learned how to make my seams better. And after residency, my dream was to make a fully embroidered 18th century court suit because I think that embroidery is just so beautiful. So with my very first paycheck as a full-fledged doctor, I actually bought an embroidery machine and that’s where the journey began.

Helen: Oh my goodness. So many beginnings, though. ‘Cause I do think, once you’ve invested in a bustle, you’re kind of committed, you know?

Christine: It’s so true. Honestly, having that lobster tail bustle, because that’s what they’re called, ’cause you kind of look like a lobster tail. You can’t just, like, wear that by itself. But you wanna wear it and then you put a dress on it and it drapes well and you look like the beautiful centaur lady that you are. It really makes it so much more magical.

Caroline: Oh my gosh.

Helen: Oh, the centaur reference is so real. It’s true. It kind of looks like you’ve got four legs going on under there.

Christine: That’s the thing we, we call ourselves, in the historical costuming community, we’re like, “Oh, you’re going for the centaur look.”

Helen: I love that for you. Well, we were really excited to have you on and get your perspective on the historical costuming community because it’s a community that we really admire, but Caroline and I don’t have a lot of experience with that type of sewing. Tell us a little bit about the historical costuming community. What’s it like?

Christine: Well, it’s not a very large community, especially compared to, say, cosplay and quilting. It’s a very niche community. There’s maybe, like, tens of thousands of us, if that. But I do think we’re a really dedicated crowd and, for the most part, I think we’re really supportive of each other. We used to be mostly on Instagram. Most of the groups are all on Facebook and everybody’s really keen to answer questions and help each other. The thing that I really like about it is that you go to these events and you meet each other and it’s so nice meeting someone else who also does it because there’s new techniques that they learn. Now for different eras, there’s different communities, because there’s more or less different scholarship based on each one. The big thing is whether or not you wanna be historically accurate, or HA, as we say. Bernadette Banner, who is a major player in the 1890s historical costume community, calls herself “historically adequate,” because we recognize it’s very impossible to be historically accurate. And there was, for some time, a lot of snootiness between people who would machine sew and who would not machine sew, or who sewed everything by hand, because it was historically accurate to the 1700s or whatnot. But nowadays, it’s become less and less of a thing, which I’m really excited about, because people could be so snooty, and you didn’t wanna gatekeep the new people, right?

Caroline: Mmhmm.

Helen: Yeah, I was thinking about that, because there would be so many different things to learn, and obviously getting these machines and these undergarments and all the fabric would be a costly endeavour as well. So trying to, like, encourage new people to come in and participate, even if they’re not HA, you know, would be, probably, a big deal for you guys.

Christine: And that’s actually something I really like about the community these days. I think we’re a lot more accepting of people who are new. And we also accept that not everyone can buy everything. So if you wanna start off pretty small and just, like, come in, in, like, a store-bought costume and then come later and then just, like, slowly build your portfolio, we’re happy to help. Or if you wanna stay someone who just buys costumes the whole time. Now we are very accepting of that because I think we also recognize that we need people who are willing to buy costumes and buy costume parts to keep the other people funded, right? Because there’s so many people who make money on the side by selling corsets, selling undergarments, selling gowns, selling accessories, that if we boo everyone who wants to pay to be part of the community, you’re basically killing the community as well. And there’s different scholarship levels, as I said. So, for instance, 18th century, AKA, the 1700s Marie Antoinette era, you know, they didn’t actually have patterns back then. They didn’t actually, like, have patterns that people could buy and sell and just use. What they would do is they would have, a dressmaker would draft the pattern directly on your body, and then they would drape the pattern pieces on the fabric on you, cut the pieces out, and then sew it together for you right there.

Helen: Right. Truly custom to the individual.

Christine: Exactly. There’s no pattern, so there’s no patterns that survive. There was no machine embroidery, so you have all these historic stitches like the English stitch, the stitch with no name, et cetera, that are very unique to this period.

Helen: Oh, that’s so cool. So are there some historical costuming events where people mix and mingle from different time periods, or does it generally try to focus on a certain time period when you’re getting together to have some kind of event or gathering?

Christine: I would say that the biggest event in all of historical costuming, at least for 18th century, is the ball at Versailles. Versailles holds a ball every May, uh, late May, early June. It’s always the first Monday of June or the last Monday of May. Anyways, you go in, and the only way you’re allowed in is if you’re wearing a historically accurate costume from 1690 to 1790, because that’s when, you know, Versailles fell.

Caroline: Wow.

Helen: Wow.

Caroline: Ooh, that’s so cool. Have you been, have you been to this ball?

Christine: I’ve been three times, and I can honestly say that, like, if you have any interest, please go. You can rent a costume if you don’t have it. No one will look down at you. I’d say 80, 90% of the people there are people who rent costumes, and it’s so magical. You walk into the Hall of Mirrors. It’s lit by candles. Everybody’s wearing a historically accurate costume to 1690 to 1790. And I say “accurate” very loosely, because there’s a lot of people who are not accurate, but they still let you in. And it’s beautiful. You drink champagne, you learn historical 18th century dances from a dance instructor in the Hall of Mirrors, and then at midnight you watch fireworks from the beautiful glass windows of Versailles and you go home.

Caroline: Oh my gosh, that sounds like a movie. It’s incredible.

Christine: It’s magical. It’s not even that expensive. It’s about 150 euros to 350 euros for a ticket.

Helen: Okay. Yeah, but, like, a once-in-a-lifetime experience. Yeah. That sounds incredible. My goodness. Okay, I’m adding that to my bucket list. Thank you.

Christine: But that answers the question of, no, it’s not like everybody has to be in exactly 1787 or you’re kicked out, you know. Like, we do it in like, hundreds, I’d say. We’d say Georgian era, Victorian era, or, like, late Victorian era. When you get to Victorian era. around 1860, you start getting patterns, like, published patterns in magazines like Ladies’ Home Journal and everything. They would have these patterns that women could cut out and use.

Helen: Right.

Caroline: Yeah.

Christine: Then you also have machine sewing at that time. So, then, historically accurate for the era means something different than in 18th century. And the scholarship is different. And then you also get these books where you could literally read how they sewed step by step. And that’s free on Online Archive as well.

Caroline: Very cool. You talking about this ball at Versailles and the in-person community is making me wonder about, like, any of our listeners who are interested in getting into historical costuming, and I wonder how important you think it is to try to find that local community where you can really, like, see the work in person and talk to people face to face about this craft. Is that a big element of this for you, or do you think, like, finding an online community is just as good?

Christine: Oh my God. I think nothing beats being person to person, face to face when you’re sewing, even if you’re having just a sewing buddy. Getting to learn from other people is such a huge part of it. For me, personally, I’ve been a big believer in starting these communities where they don’t exist. For instance, back in 2016 when I lived in St. Louis, there was nothing like it. There was a reenactor community, but I was less interested in reenacting because reenacting is usually lower-class and I want to reproduce higher-class outfits, like the ball gowns that you get. So, for me, I started my own, um, like, sewing community in St. Louis and I found dozens of us. The first meetup I had, I had like 12 people show up to my house and I was so excited because I hadn’t really met anyone face to face other than some other conventions for sewing. So it was really important that I start that. And now, in Chicago, there is the Chicago Historical Costuming Society, which I am a member of. I’m not an officer, but I also wanna throw my own events, like my own balls and everything. And it’s much easier if I do it on my own. So I also create the Salon Society of Chicago where we can all help each other as well.

Caroline: Yeah. And we saw on your social media that you’re planning a ball right now, so how’s that going?

Christine: Oh my God, it’s going really well. We’re already sold out of tickets.

Caroline: Oh my gosh!

Christine: They sold out in, like, 30 hours, actually.

Caroline: Wow. Congrats. That’s awesome.

Christine: Thank you. Which I think proves that there’s a large community of people who want to go to these events. And I had 200 tickets and, again, they sold out completely in 30 hours. And the big thing about it is that. That’s Versailles, which is the big 18th century ball. There’s lots of, like, Victorian balls in other parts of the country. But there’s nothing really like that on a yearly basis in Chicago. Chicago Historical Costuming Society threw one, I think two years back, and it was a huge success but, um, they weren’t gonna be throwing one anytime soon. So I said, “You know what? I’m just gonna throw it myself. I’ll just rent a venue and I’ll do it.”

Caroline: That’s so cool. We’re, like, a year out from this event, right?

Christine: Yes. I’ve thrown other balls before. I’m a big believer in giving people one year to sew, so that if you are a beginner, you have time.

Caroline: Yes. That’s what I was thinking, is you must need to give people that runway to be able to make these incredible gowns to wear to this event. So that’s awesome.

Christine: Thank you. I really wanna give people the time to actually make whatever they want because I’m not a fast sewist myself. I’d say my dresses usually take four months minimum. So who am I to give people less time than that?

Caroline: Yeah. We wanted to ask you a little bit about, sort of historical costuming in general and, and your perspective on it. I think that some people think that it romanticizes the past a little bit, and I wanted to know what your perspective on that is.

Christine: Oh man, that’s a loaded question.

Caroline: I know.

Christine: I also think it’s a really, really important question. It’s one of the most important questions out there. We have this community of people that say the phrase “Vintage style, not vintage values.” And that is what we really say. Because, in truth, like, 18th century, yes, we’re dressing like Marie Antoinette, but it’s also a time that had slavery. You know, women had very little rights compared to now. We had no vaccines and we had nothing of the modern amenities that we do today. So we don’t wanna celebrate the way that they lived because we think that that was a better life. We’re not looking, “Oh, the good old days.” We’re just saying, “Man, those fashions are fun.” And we really just wanna say we like the fashion. We don’t like the way that they viewed people of colour. We don’t like the way that they looked at people of different transgender status. We only, only to look at the fashion, and maybe that’s such a narrow view, because it is impossible to look at it in a certain light and not know what it means. So, for instance, there’s this general unwritten rule in all of historical costuming in the United States that nobody does 1860s, because the 1860s gowns, even though they’re really pretty with the, you know, tiny waist and the big skirts and the hoop skirts, they’re also kind of worn a lot as a symbol of the Good Old South nowadays. And the Confederacy.

Helen: Oh, okay.

Christine: And, unfortunately, Gone with the Wind has ruined that for everyone forever at this point, even though we love the costumes in that movie, I mean, the, those costumes are gorgeous. But I mean, think about the last time you saw anyone in the, in the United States, not Europe, do 1860s on purpose.

Helen: Mmhmm. Yeah.

Christine: And for that era, we really understand that there’s no way to do the 1860s without also, like, saying something about what it means and the idea of the Southern Belle and the idea of the Good Old South. So we just stay away from that in general. Also, for a lot of easy’s sake, a lot of people will do 1870s events and beyond but, um, they won’t throw balls for, like, Georgian era as frequently, or eras before that. So, I mean, you’d find people doing Georgian eras a lot in Europe because, you know, they didn’t have that question of slavery as deeply as we do in the United States. I have thrown Georgian balls as well, but I mean, it’s a little different when you really just try not to touch anything from 1840 to 1860s.

Caroline: Mmhmm.

Helen: It’s truly so much to consider when you’re making these costumes, and I’m sure you have historical interest in the time period as well. So it’s a unique opportunity to learn about what was going on in the time period of the costume that you’re making. And another interesting thing is just that a lot of times the costumes are being made by people who would never get to wear those costumes. So in a unique way, you’re celebrating the people who are actually doing the work of making the costumes, the mantua makers and embroiderers, not just the people who are wearing them, if that makes sense.

Christine: Helen, you are so right. I can’t agree more. The bulk of all the sewing, all the embroidering, was done by women. At the end of the day, when you are remaking a museum piece, 99.999% chance, you are celebrating women’s work and the work of unnamed women, because very few women signed these gowns. So for instance, I make fun of Worth because he’s, like, the quote “first designer,” but, like, at the same time, women did the sewing. So you are also celebrating the women who did that.

Helen: Yeah. That’s so cool. We love that.

Christine: Yes. I really wish that more women signed their work. I have a bunch of Sewstine labels that I sew onto my dresses now.

Helen: Yes. That’s so smart. Well, and I just went to a quilting convention, and there was a big emphasis on labeling the quilt because there’s so many quilts where we have no idea who made them, historical quilts, for very similar reasons. So, yes, it’s important to sign your work.

Christine: That’s so sad. I’m so glad that we’re emphasizing that now because it’s never a problem when it’s, like, men’s labour. Like, when every single sketch that Picasso does, he, like, numbers it and signs it, and women make these amazing gowns that take three times as much time as Picasso spent on that drawing, and they will not even put their initials. It just breaks my heart.

Helen: Yeah. Okay. Well, let’s switch gears here for a second because I’d love to know what your favourite and least favourite parts of making these costumes is. Do you have something that you absolutely love and something that you dread?

Christine: Oh my God, that’s such a good question. My favourite part is that moment when you have that dress and you put it on the dress form and you realize that the vision that you had in your head is going to come out exactly the way you planned it. That is, like, the moment I live for, it’s the highest of high endorphins I get, sewing. And you know how, when you first start making a dress, you have this vision in your head of how you want it to look. You can draw it out. Some people draw it out, some people go directly to making it. And then, you know, you’re not quite sure if it’s going to work. You know, you have all the pieces, you have the fabric, you have the pattern, you’ve been sewing and you’re not really sure. But then there’s that moment where you’re like, “Oh my God, it’s going to be just as good if not better.”

Helen: I love that. Yes. I’m sure all of our listeners can relate to that magical feeling.

Christine: That is my favourite part. You know, obviously I love drafting the pattern. I like realizing that the drafting came out right. I like digitizing, seeing that embroidery stitch out just right and making it work. And I do love the whole process. It’s really funny. My least favourite parts of sewing are sewing on the closures, AKA the hooks and eyes and the bars. Oh my God, I hate that part. I will literally pin myself into every dress I can until I absolutely have to sew in closures.

Helen: That’s so funny. But I’m sure the closures result in that, like, final fit, right? So it’s, like, the part that you dislike the most is the part that gets you to that end phase where you can really see how it finally fits.

Christine: I mean, it’s yes and no. But, like, 18th century dresses, you don’t have hooks or eyes, really. You actually pin yourself into the dress.

Caroline: Wow. So do you ever pin yourself into the dress, like, forever? Like, never put in a closure?

Christine: So, 18th century dresses, there are some hooks and eyes, but those are more like rare cases. Usually, you will pin yourself into the dress, and that’s historically accurate. They have these dress pins that are very thick. And you’re not gonna hurt yourself because you have these stays on which protect you from the pins.

Caroline: Right. Are they like safety pins, or?

Christine: Nope, they look like nails, honestly. A lot of us often will use very fine nails from the hardware store,

Caroline: Wow. Okay. That’s very cool.

Christine: And the skirts are tied on. The pins just, like, pin you in and the stays protect you from the pins. So I don’t actually have to sew closures until after, like, 1870.

Helen: Oh, well that’s why you like 18th century gowns. I get it now.

Caroline: Okay, my next question was gonna be like, are there any historical design features or details that you’d like to see come back to modern clothing? And I’m assuming it’s not the nails. Or maybe it is?

Helen: Maybe it is, though. Yeah, she might not like sewing invisible zippers.

Caroline: Yeah, you can just pin yourself in. But yeah, tell us, are there any details that you’d like to see come back into modern clothing?

Christine: I want more bishop sleeves. And I want, honestly, I want more embroidery. And thirdly, the other thing I would really love to see come back, I think this is a big part of the historical costuming community as well, is the idea of sustainable clothing that we fix and mend and wear and wear and wear for years.

Caroline: Mmhmm.

Christine: And again, like, that’s such a privileged thing to say. I want, you know, clothing that we can wash and over and over and over again. ‘Cause there’s so much money that goes into it to begin with. But the idea of clothing was very different in the 18th century because fabric was so expensive. The reason that almost all the shapes are squares is because squares was more economical than cutting, like, wedges out for skirts and so forth. So all, almost all the shapes in 18th century sewing is either a square or triangle. And it worked for them. And uh, you know, because they would use every possible scrap. And I love the idea of making do with less and just re-wearing and mending. And I love that trend for a lot of historical costumers.

Caroline: Yeah.

Helen: Yeah, that’s a great one. Well, and I imagine the undergarments helps a lot in that case because you do have these under things that you’re washing more, maybe more frequently than the exterior garment, which rarely gets washed.

Christine: Exactly, Helen, that’s 100% true. They would wear these linen shifts and they would wear it under their stays, AKA what we would call a corset today. And that would get sweaty and they would just wash that. And that would get washed every day. Like, they would have seven for seven days of the week.

Helen: Wow. Okay. So we just all need to wear linen shifts. We solved it.

Christine: Well, I actually wear just a lot of linen dresses. And linen dresses, fabric, linen is the, is one fiber that gets stronger when it’s wet, versus weaker when it’s wet like cotton. So linen, you can machine wash it like 300, 400 times and it’s fine. So most of my wardrobe is actually linen now.

Caroline: Mm.

Helen: Well, I think a lot of our listeners can relate on that one. We have a lot of linen fans out there. Including ourselves.

Caroline: Yeah.

Christine: Again, I feel bad saying that because, I mean, linen is so much more expensive than cotton to begin with, too, so that’s not fair. But it’s just one of those things where, when you invest in linen to begin with, it just lasts for years.

Caroline: Yeah. Amazing. Okay, I think we wanna get into the technique side of costuming and talk about the details a little bit. You mentioned that you work on about two dresses a year. But I’ve also heard you say that you have many projects kind of on the go at once. So can you tell us a little bit more about how you balance your different projects and how many things you have going at once?

Christine: So currently I have six projects going. I don’t always have this many, but I just finished moving my house and I had zero projects going, so I kind of overcompensated and started six at the same time. Normally these days I put out probably four dresses a year. Two dresses a year was during medical school and residency, when I had a lot less time. Because residency is this period after medical school where you work about 80 hours a week, and for very little money, and you’re getting more training, which is great, but it is also a system of abuse because residents are so much cheaper than doctors and you still get a lot of labour done. So in any case, during that four year period, I definitely did not sew as much. Nowadays, I would say I sew somewhere between four big projects and two littler projects a year. And I usually have them in different stages. The reason being is that depending on whatever I feel like doing that day, I can do that. If I feel like just embroidering about 150 hours for a court suit, I can have my machine going and just do that and still feel like I’ve accomplished something while I’m babysitting an embroidery machine. I usually have one dress or two dresses in the hand sewing stage so that I have something that I can sit while watching TV on my post-call days, after I’ve worked 24 hours but can’t sleep, and just do a little bit of hand sewing. And it’s so relaxing with my little Cavalier King Charles Spaniel on my lap. It’s very idyllic.

Helen: Oh my gosh. What a picture.

Christine: It makes a beautiful picture, but in actuality, he has the worst sinus, though. It’s very noisy and not that peaceful.

Helen: It still sounds pretty good.

Christine: Thank you. And then, for days when I feel like puzzling something out, I usually have a project that’s in the drafting stage, where I’m still trying to piece, draft the right pattern and get the pieces together. So, and then other times I just have it in different stages. Every now and then I’m, I’m gonna get more absorbed in one project than another and just finish it and, like, hammer it out in like a week or two just because I get obsessed with it. And then the other will go to the back burner. And I often do this because, um, that way if one of the projects really just aren’t turning out right, like I really, really hate it, I can drop it, chuck it and not feel bad because the other five are still going.

Caroline: Mmhmm.

Helen: You’re like, “I don’t need you anymore.”

Christine: “I don’t need you anymore.” Like, the thing about it is, whenever you’re drawing, you know, how many times do you mess up a drawing before you get a drawing that you love? Versus every single time we start a dress, if it doesn’t turn out, you’re like, “Oh my God, we’re a failure because this one dress is not working out.” But the truth is, you know, it’s okay to mess up in sewing and say “This is not gonna work out” and chuck it. And I feel like, because it takes us so much more time to get to the point where we know that a project is a failure in sewing than drawing, we try not to and make excuses and let that, like, stop us from doing something else.

Helen: Yeah, it’s true. You feel like you really invested time and a lot of money, in some cases, so it can be really hard to let it go. But, ultimately, it’d be so much better to start on something that is gonna work out or take the lessons that you’ve learned and apply it to the next project.

Christine: That’s exactly it, Helen. Like, I just feel like we put so much pressure on ourselves to make every project worth it because the cost for the fabric and the time cost is so much higher for sewing than drawing or anything else. I say this as someone who also draws a lot. I actually started out in, wanting to become a fashion illustrator back in high school.

Helen: Oh wow. That’s so cool. I’m sure that comes in handy.

Christine: It does. Actually, I think that’s why I like digitizing historical embroidery, because it’s basically just drawing, but with threads.

Helen: Oh, amazing. Okay. You mentioned so many things that we need to follow up on. First things first, can you set the scene for us in your sewing room? What kind of sewing machines do you have and use to make these historical costumes?

Christine: Okay, so I have a Baby Lock Soprano; that’s my main sewing machine. My embroidery machines are two Baby Lock Ventures. They are downstairs because they’re very loud and they need their own room. I also have a Baby Lock serger as well. Just a heads up, full disclosure, I am sponsored by Baby Lock. I had the opportunity to be picked by multiple machine companies, ’cause they were all looking for an embroiderer. But I really liked Baby Lock because they were St. Louis located, which is where I was living at the time, and I wanted to support local.

Helen: Yeah. Very cool. Oh, well, congrats on the sponsorship. That’s awesome.

Christine: Thank you. They have paid for my two Baby Lock Ventures, which are 10 needle embroidery machines. They’re big, powerful workhorses with a 14 by 8 inch hoop. So even though one, you know, 14 by 8 is fairly large, it’s not large enough to, say, do a full court suit. So something like my husband’s last court suit took 34 different re-hoopings and embroideries to do.

Helen: Yeah, because you’re not just embroidering a small area on the project. You’re often embroidering, like, a whole trim or whole yardage in some cases. Is that right?

Christine: Yes, that is correct.

Helen: Wow. So you have to kind of move the area that the machine is embroidering on constantly to create that whole thing.

Christine: Yes, exactly.

Helen: Oh, very cool. Well, since you got the machine for free, how much does a machine like that cost?

Christine: You know, I haven’t asked. Back in 2018, when I signed the contract, I believe it was a $22,000 machine.

Caroline: Wow!

Helen: Wow. Okay. No joke.

Caroline: Yeah. I’m sure there are more entry level machines out there, though.

Christine: There are. That’s a 10 needle machine with a 14 by 8 inch area. My very first one, I believe it’s called the Pathfinder now, the Baby Lock Pathfinder. That’s the one that I got when I first started out. And I wanna also encourage everyone to also look on the used market because I think that people really don’t want to buy a used machine. But, you know, that’s a really great way to get started for, you know, half the price or even less.

Helen: Yeah, that’s really great advice.

Christine: The important thing, though, is that what you do need, if you wanna digitize your own things, is a digitizing software. Baby Lock’s version is the Palette, and I use Pallette 11. So, basically, it’s a special software where you draw whatever shape you want, embroidered. Then you choose to stitch type what, whether you want a satin stitch or a fill stitch. and then you can draw lines and you actually determine the stitch density, the stitch directionality. You have a lot of control and it’s actually not that hard to get started. I even have some videos showing how to digitize because I like showing and sharing all knowledge so that nobody has to reinvent the wheel every time. And then you can basically draw whatever you want and the machine will stitch it out. It’s so magical seeing it happen.

Helen: Oh, that’s so cool. Yeah. And we’ve seen you replicate some historical embroideries from museum pieces, which is absolutely incredible. And then recreate that, and then you can use it for your projects. And you also sell them in your Etsy shop, is that right?

Christine: That’s right. There’s a lot of other historical digitizers as well. For me, personally, I price mine based on what other people are pricing it at, because I want to make sure I’m not competition. This is not my main living. I work full-time as a physician, so for me, I just wanna make sure that the files are available for people who want to do it. I will say, my files are designed for a 10 needle, so there’s, like, sometimes there’s like 43 color repeats on mine.

Caroline: Wow.

Helen: Wow. That’s so cool. It must be so much fun to watch it go.

Christine: It’s honestly so rhythmic. When I’m tired and post-call and I have no energy, I’ll just bring up a chair and watch it embroider. It’s, it’s so awesome.

Caroline: Okay. I’m, my mind goes to, like, I freak out when I have to re-thread my four thread serger. So what is it like threading a 10 needle embroidery machine?

Christine: Okay. So, my suggestion to anyone buying an embroidery machine is: do not buy any machine that doesn’t have an auto-threader. Like, do not thread your own machine like an animal. Like, make it do it for you.

Caroline: Yeah.

Helen: If you’re investing this much already, just spend a little extra. Get the auto-threader.

Caroline: So true. It’s so true.

Christine: So, it’s so miserable. So, again, I do recommend, like, an entry, good entry-level is a Pathfinder. It has a thread cutter. It also has an auto-threader.

Helen: Okay, that’s great. We’ll link that up in the show notes. Okay. You said you like to sit and watch the embroidery, but I wanna know if you have to sit and watch the embroidery while it works or can you kind of set it and forget it?

Christine: I honestly set it and forget it. One thing that I do like and hate about my embroidery machine is that there’s an app that connects on my phone that lets me know when the machine runs into trouble. So I can literally just walk around the house or even go to work and just forget about it, and I’ll come home later and check on it when I want to or when it dings. Again, like, sometimes I hate the notification system because I just wanna not think about it. And here it is, dinging at me.

Caroline: It’s like a robot vacuum.

Christine: Exactly! So, a lot of my embroideries, like, they take forever. I’m doing this current embroidery where every repeat of it is about six hours.

Helen: Wow.

Christine: It’s like 50,000 stitches per repeat. And it’s beautiful. It’s very dense. And I do it because, in order to get that painted look that’s very historical in 18th century, you know, you do need a stitch density of about 140 stitches per inch. So it’s a lot of stitches, so it takes forever. But so, oftentimes, I’ll do it and it’ll ding often, you know, depending on the type of stitching I’m doing. It might need me to come and check on it every 15 minutes. Other times it’s every, like, hour and a half.

Caroline: And like what sort of issues come up? Is it, like, threads getting knotted? Is it running out of thread? Like, what is it dinging for?

Helen: Is it, it’s, it’s just stitching a totally different thing now?

Caroline: Yeah.

Christine: Honestly, all of the above. Um, the most common thing is that I use silk threads because, even though they’re very expensive, nothing really replicates that 18th century shine on the fabric than silk threads. So I use a lot of silk threads and those only come in a hundred meter little spools. They’re so tiny, so you have to refill them constantly.

Caroline: Okay.

Christine: Sometimes, it might get tangled and need me to, uh, do it. Other times I need to replace the bobbin. It doesn’t get lost or do the wrong thing very frequently. Or the tension on the machine has been so high that the thread snapped. But silk thread and polyester threads are the two most strong fibers. So I will try to sew with one of those, too.

Helen: Right. And then, what kind of fabric and or stabilizer are you embroidering onto, typically?

Christine: It depends on the look. If I’m going for a full frock coat, I will often use a double-faced silk satin. I will usually use a pretty strong tear-away. Baby Lock, of course, since I’m one of theirs, will send me free stabilizers. So I use Baby Lock, and their tearaway is great. I have used other ones from Amazon and it’s worked fairly well. If I’m working on, say, something that is very delicate looking, say a cotton dress with very, like, light embroidery, I will often use one layer of cotton voile. I get that from Burnley and Trowbridge. And the cotton voile I’ll often machine wash, iron, and then back with two layers of wash-away stabilizer.

Helen: Okay, so ideally, the stabilizer’s not visible in the end.

Christine: No. I think, in an ideal world, there is absolutely no stabilizer at the end, but we both know that doesn’t happen.

Caroline: Mmhmm.

Helen: Yeah. So, since you’re replicating gowns that didn’t have this machine embroidery technology, at the time, it would’ve been done by hand. Right?

Christine: Yes. My favourite era for embroidery is 18th century, and that’s one of the reasons I’m so obsessed with it, is because to some degree it’s very naturalistic, and at the same time it’s fantasy because they didn’t know that much. But you can see how they hand drew it and everything’s done by hand, so everything’s just a little clumsy. No two flowers, if you look closely, are exactly the same. They’re always slightly different. The way that it was done is they would have a large piece of silk, like the entire frock coat, on a huge hoop. The master embroiderer, usually male, would draw out the pattern, and then the embroiderers, usually women, would then sit and embroider the piece over months, and we’re talking about not one woman sewing and making it. We’re talking about six women working on one piece, all huddled together, gossiping while they sewed it together.

Helen: Oh, I love that visual. That’s so incredible, though. Like, the amount of craftsmanship and effort that would go into just a single piece of fabric is mind-blowing.

Christine: And it’s so beautiful. Like, you can look at these embroidered frock coats and I think they’re absolutely stunning and masterpieces. And, as I said, because you had so many different people and doing this by hand day after day, no two flowers are actually exactly the same, if you look. So, frequently, to try to mimic that, I will have multiple repeats of different pieces, slightly different from each other, to kind of replicate that feeling of 18th century embroidery. And I try to capture that feeling of the layered look as well as the shading that they did. And because everything was done by hand, they don’t care when they’re changing thread, if they’re changing colour or not. ‘Cause it’s not much more effort. So there’s so many color changes that I have to replicate. So then you end up changing threads like 60 times on one repeat.

Helen: Right? I wonder if those people back then would look at the machine now and think, “Too much effort. I’ll just do it by hand.”

Christine: You know, I think there is something like that. And I actually used to get a lot of crap from the historical community because I was using a machine and it wasn’t historically accurate. But I also don’t have six women working for me in my basement.

Caroline: Yeah. You’re like, “I have a full-time job. Come on.”

Christine: So, like, the machine is, you know, is my people working. And on top of that, I do think that people put too much pressure on themselves, like, to get everything right. Because nowadays everyone’s like, “Oh, I have to make my own corset. I have to make my own hat. I have to make my own dress. I have to make…” One person didn’t do it all back then, you know. There was a hat maker, there was a mantua maker, there was a…stay maker was a completely different profession, you know?

Helen: Yeah, totally. That’s a great point. Well, it just speaks to the dedication of the costuming community, wanting to do it all.

Christine: I think it’s amazing, but also, I am at the point where I’m like, “I’m just gonna do the parts I like.”

Helen: Yeah. Totally. Do the parts that excite you.

Caroline: It’s supposed to be fun, too, right? Like it’s, this is a hobby. It’s…

Christine: Completely. So, I’m a cardiac anesthesiologist. I often work in ICUs and everything, and the mortality can be depressing. So a lot of this is also done for my personal emotional stability. It’s so nice coming home and trying to make something beautiful. Because there’s surviving and then there’s making art. Because making art is really living.

Caroline: Yeah.

Helen: Oh, that’s beautiful. Okay, I wanna come back to drafting and patterns for a moment, ’cause we touched on that. But I’d love to hear a little bit more about how you learned how to draft your own patterns. We know you’ve made your own bodice block, and there’s also historical pattern companies out there. So can you talk a little bit about patterning and how you approach that?

Christine: Sure. I am very, very lucky in that I have a dress form that is my body shape wearing a set of 18th century stays. I got mine from Beatrice. They make a really great 3D scan body that they then cut out. And once I have that, I will use one eighth inch paper tape to basically draw out the pattern pieces onto the dress form itself. And I often will use books, like there’s a book that just basically shows you how every single decade of dresses put their seams and where all those seams go, what the shapes of those seams are, and I’ll replicate it on my dress form. And once I have it drawn on my dress form, I then put cotton muslin on and then trace it out piece by piece. I then add a seam allowance, cut it out, make a mockup, and then kind of clean it up a little bit. And there you go. You have your pattern.

Caroline: So it’s sort of like a draping technique, right?

Christine: Yes. I think it’s exactly the draping technique. And I learned it mostly just by reading a lot of different blogs. I can’t give credit to any one blog. It was just by reading a lot of different ones and also reading books on draping and combining the two.

Helen: Wow. That sounds so cool.

Christine: Thank you. And then, for the sleeves, I often will just buy the pattern. There’s a bunch of great 18th century patterns, places like Scroop Patterns, that sell great patterns if you want to just work from someone else’s. And oftentimes, even though I can drape my own, I will often use someone else’s pattern because it’s actually faster to cut out a pattern and then pin it to your body and then adjust it than it is to do the draping technique.

Caroline: Yeah.

Helen: Right. Yeah. Let someone else do some of the work for you. Take a load off.

Christine: Exactly. And those places have great sleeves because I personally haven’t found a great way to draft sleeves yet. So that’s my method. I use, uh, the bodice, the body block that I basically drafted and then add the sleeves and the skirts from other pattern companies.

Helen: Very cool. So are you often re-wearing the, kind of, base layer undergarments that you have and then you’re adding the dress on top, right?

Christine: Yes.

Helen: Or are you starting from the bottom up every time?

Christine: It depends. I only really go get and make, make a whole start from the base up when I’m starting a new decade. So 18th century, it’s the conical shape. Every dress has that shape, basically. It’s slightly different on whether or not you’re before 1870 or after 1870 because of the way that the back is shaped. But other than that, it’s very, very similar. And I use the same stays and underwear for almost all of it. When you get to 1880, an 1880 body shape is different from an 1870 body shape, which is different from an 1890s, which is different from a 1900s. So then I have four different corsets for those four decades.

Helen: Obviously.

Christine: It’s, so, it gets very expensive. But if you’re not sure about the 1880s, just buy an 1880s corset. It’ll be almost perfect for all four decades.

Helen: Okay. Yeah. Wow. It’s really cool that you’re drafting your own patterns for these garments. It sounds really complicated, but I’m sure as you get into it and you practice, it’s maybe a little bit more straightforward than it sounds to people out there. And the dress form sounds amazing, so we’ll link up the resources for that as well.

Christine: I also wanna mention, if you don’t wanna spend like $1,600 on a dress form immediately, please just get duct tape and make your own duct tape dress form. It works the same way. And then you, once you make that dress form and put it on a microphone stand, just put your corset on it, lace it up to the same measurements as yourself, and you can basically do the same thing.

Helen: Oh, great tip.

Caroline: That’s a great tip. Yeah.

Helen: We’ve seen a lot of duct tape dress forms out there.

Christine: Yes. And it’s so great for drafting. My first 10 dresses were drafted on a duct tape dress form. I have nothing against it.

Caroline: Oh, awesome. I find myself thinking about fabric for these huge gowns.

Helen: Do you, Caroline?

Caroline: Yeah. I’m, like, just imagining the fabric consumption charts for a dress like this, and I just, I must know how much fabric you use for one of these gowns.

Christine: I am five foot zero. I am five foot three wearing heels. So I probably use less fabric than anyone else on the planet for these dresses, and I still use somewhere between 10 and 12 per gown.

Caroline: Wow. 10 to 12, that’s, okay.

Helen: Wow. I’ve never worn that much fabric at once, honestly.

Caroline: Yeah. Is it heavy?

Christine: It’s so heavy. So, remember when you asked me earlier, what are your least favourite parts of it? I would say that my other least favorite part is actually wearing it. I love making it. Like, wearing them is, is sometimes such a pain in the butt. So I, like, I love going to the balls and everything and I love it and have such a great time, but it takes me like 25 minutes to get dressed. And, like, the older I get, I’m just like, “Oh my God, I could put on scrubs in 10 seconds.”

Helen: Yeah, that was a question that we had coming up, actually, was how comfortable are you when you’re wearing these costumes? ‘Cause we had Bernadette Banner on the show and she swore up and down that she’s comfortable AF and loves wearing her costumes. But it is a different era, so, you know.

Christine: So, you know, that’s the thing I, I think I said I hate putting on the costumes. I actually love wearing it.

Caroline: Okay.

Helen: Okay. Yeah, that makes sense. ‘Cause you get it all in place and laced up and everything, it kind of settles in. Is that right?

Christine: That’s right. And so I wanna emphasize that how I wear a dress for a photo shoot is very different from, say, how I would wear it to a ball or an event or just around. When I wear it for a photo shoot, I will tight lace the crap out of that corset. It’ll be so tight, it’ll be like skin tight, trying to get me that very cinched waist and silhouette. And it is not very comfortable because no one in the 18th century really dressed like that unless they, too, were trying to send a message. And there are people who were known to have tightlaced, but for the most part, like, I usually will put my corset on and it’s pretty loose. I can breathe in it, run up and down stairs. It’s not a big deal and it’s not very uncomfortable at all. It’s, honestly, 18th century is one, one of my favourite decades to wear because it’s so comfortable. So, that, I wanna emphasize, Bernadette is not wrong. It’s just, it still takes me like 25 minutes to get dressed.

Helen: Yeah, that’s a lot, with all the different layers.

Christine: All the different layers. And then, um, doing my hair and makeup. I’m someone who very rarely wears makeup. So, you know, that’s the pain in the butt. Honestly, once I’m wearing it, it’s like, whatever. I can, I can drive a car in this, it’s fine.

Caroline: Oh my gosh.

Helen: That’s impressive. Even with the lobster tail?

Christine: The lobster tail, like, collapses. It’s actually really one of the most comfortable eras. The less comfortable eras are, like, 1880s, where they have the big pillow butts and there is no, like, collapsibility to it. So you’ll sit in your car and you’ll have to be, like, leaning forward, hoping your big hedgehog head won’t get squished in the, in the rear view mirror.

Helen: We need to hire you a driver, Christine. I’m concerned for your safety.

Christine: Thank you. So it’s like, that’s the kind of thing that’s a bigger problem is like, there is a whole thing of hats versus cars, like, in costuming. ‘Cause like our hats and hair will always be a…will get in the way. ‘Cause our cars really aren’t meant for our big hair.

Helen: Yeah, it’s true. They need, you need to be in a carriage for that.

Caroline: Yeah. Yes. It’s really not meant for it. So it’s, that’s one thing. But as I said, I hate getting into it because it’s so many layers and so much, like, pinning, especially for 18th century. I will say, Edwardian and 1890s is a lot more comfortable. And Bernadette also, um, I don’t believe she wears stays very frequently because of her back. So that’s the other thing. Bernadette once said in one of her videos, um, she and I are friends, that she finds skirts so much warmer than pants. And it is so true. Like, in the winter when it gets really cold in Chicago, like negative 10 degrees, I’ll put on wool stockings, some petticoats, a wool petticoat, and my skirt. I am so much warmer than I am wearing jeans.

Helen: Oh, that’s so interesting. I guess it’s like the glove versus mitts thing, right?

Christine: Yes, because you have layers. Yes.

Helen: Because your fingers are separate, and then when you get cold, you put them together, then they’re toasty.

Christine: Yes. And you, and you have so much heat trapping under all those layers of wool. And wool works.

Caroline: Yeah. Yeah.

Helen: It’s true. It’s a magical fiber.

Caroline: Oh, wow. This is all so fascinating.

Christine: So yeah, as I said, I just hate putting it on. Once I’m in, it actually is fairly comfortable unless I’m doing a photo shoot and the whole idea of it is to look very, very high fashion. And there are certain dresses that I have made that I love but I hate wearing because they’re so uncomfortable. For instance, recently I made that bee gown. It’s a dress that I embroidered with a ton of bees, and in order to get that, like, heavy draped look for the skirt, I ended up using 80 yards of silk gauze on the skirt.

Helen: Oh my gosh. Wow.

Christine: And I was like, “Oh, 80 yards of silk gauze.” That’s not a big deal. It’s only three ounces per yard. It turns out that when you have 80 of it, it’s a lot. So that skirt is like 25 pounds. It really is a pain in the butt to wear, but it’s so beautiful. I need to fix it at some point. But it has, I, I haven’t done it yet.

Helen: It is so beautiful. I can’t even believe that you can fit 80 yards of any fabric in one dress. That is mind blowing. Wow. So do you have a favorite source for your fabric? Do you always kind of go to the same places? I know that sometimes your costumes come from finding the perfect fabric, and then you’re ready to make the costume, right?

Christine: Yes. I mean, there’s a lot. We don’t make the same fabrics that we used to make back in the 18th and 19th centuries. The way that we weave it is different. The thickness is different, but, um, certain silks, I find, embroider extraordinarily well. So, double-faced silk duchesse from New York Designer Fabrics is my go-to for silk embroidered pieces, just because, you know, when you embroider, there’s that tension in the fabric, right? So then you have those, like, the wrinkles between embroidery that show up, which is very, very hard to avoid. I realized the secret to avoiding it is: just use very thick fabrics to begin with, which is also the technique that was used in the 18th century because their silks were so tightly woven that they didn’t really pull the same way.

Caroline: Mm.

Helen: Right.

Christine: And so, to do that, I find that I use a, I I keep going back to New York Designer silk fabrics for that. My favourite cotton voile, or mull, M-U-L-L, is from Burnley and Trowbridge, just because it embroiders so beautifully.

Helen: Oh, okay. We’ll definitely link these up for people who wanna source these fabrics, too.

Christine: So those are my two go-tos. Otherwise, every now and then I just find the perfect fabric. Duran Textiles makes the most beautiful 18th century silk that are brocaded, and so I try to get some from them as well. And otherwise, every now and then, you know, I just have to buy some silk taffeta and start going at it with a sharpie.

Helen: You’ve really inspired me, honestly, because I, like I said, I love the black and white prints. And since you said that at the top of the show, I have just been thinking about sharpie-ing fabric and how much fun that would be. I probably wouldn’t do 10 yards of it, but just to do a top or something. It could be so much fun.

Christine: It really worked. And, uh, the Arteza markers, I want to add, after you do it, you iron it and it doesn’t bleed. So you’re all set there. And remember, it’s not about the speed. It’s about making what you want to make.

Helen: Yeah. Very cool. Well, with that in mind, we have one final question before we wrap up, and that is: what advice would you give to our listeners who are interested in starting to sew historical costumes?

Christine: Oh my goodness. I would say, you know, it’s okay to start from anywhere. Do the part that inspires you. If, you know, you can get a cheap corset, do everything else. Just make what you want. And don’t be afraid to start small. And also don’t be afraid to start big, just start with your favourite part that inspires you the most and just go for it. I also wanna mention that, the way that I sew, the reason I’m so slow is because I don’t have that much free time. So what I do is I force myself to sew one hour a day. And it turns out, if you sew one hour a day every day, that’s seven hours a week. That’s 30 hours a month. And in four months, that’s 120 hours. You have just finished an extremely fancy dress.

Caroline: Oh, that is great, like, universal sewing advice. Work on a project that inspires you and excites you, and just do a little bit every day. I love it.

Christine: Thank you.

Caroline: Okay, Christine, can you tell our listeners where they can find you online and see all of these incredible gowns that you make?

Christine: I am mostly on Instagram and YouTube. My handle is Sewstine, S-E-W-S-T-I-N-E. That’s because my husband’s nickname for me is Stine, or when I’m a mom, I’m Momstine. When I’m at work, I’m Doctorstine, and so forth. So when I’m sewing, I’m Sewstine.

Helen: I love it.

Caroline: Awesome. It was such a pleasure talking to you today. Thank you so, so much for coming on the show and sharing all your knowledge with us.

Christine: Thank you so much for having me. This was a lot of fun.

Caroline: Okay, bye.

Helen: Bye. Take care.

Caroline: That’s it for today’s episode of Love to Sew. You can find me, Caroline, at Blackbird Fabrics and BF patterns, and Helen at Helen’s Closet Patterns and Cedar Quilt Co. We’re recording in beautiful British Columbia, Canada.

Helen: You can support Love to Sew and get access to bonus content by subscribing on Patreon or Apple Podcasts. You even get access to the back catalog of bonus episodes. That’s over 75 hours of Love to Sew. Go to patreon.com/lovetosew or check out our podcast page on Apple Podcasts for more info.

Caroline: You can head to lovetosewpodcast.com to find our show notes. They’re filled with links and pictures from this episode. And if you’d like to get in touch with us, leave us a message at 1-844-SEW-WHAT. That’s 1-844-739-9428. Or send us an email at hello@lovetosewpodcast.com.

Helen: Thanks to our amazing podcast team. Lisa Ruiz is our creative assistant and Jordan Moore of The Pod Cabin is our editor. And thank you for listening. We’ll talk to you next week.

Caroline: Buh-Bye!

Helen: Bye!

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